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There is Something About the Irish

Posted by Jim_Daly on Mar 17, 2011 8:40:23 AM

With a name like Daly and on a day like this, would you expect me to say anything less?stpatrick2.jpg

 

According to the books, the Dalys hail from the High King Tara (AD 380 to 405). In later years they were found all over Ireland, especially in the counties Clare, Cork and Galway. Today there are over 30,000 of us in Ireland alone.

 

If there is something about the Irish, there’s also something fun about St. Patrick’s Day. Maybe it’s that it comes in the middle of a bland month, where it’s not quite winter, and for most of us, not quite spring. Or maybe it’s because for at least a day, most everyone seems to embrace the Irish, political and social rivalries notwithstanding.

 

News reports will be filled today with images of parades and revelers, some reveling too much. There will be the sounds of fiddlers playing jigs and singing old tunes of the motherland, some sad, some not.  I wonder how many of our kids will be reminded of not just who we’re celebrating – but why?

 

It’s widely known that St. Patrick was actually not Irish. He was born in Britain. When he was 16 he was captured by thieves looting his parent’s estate. He was taken to Ireland and enslaved for six years, escaped and retreated back to Britain. Although some accounts of his life differ, the History Channel summed up the remaining years of post-enslavement life this way:celticcross.jpg

 

Soon after (his escape), Patrick began religious training, a course of study that lasted more than fifteen years. After his ordination as a priest, he was sent to Ireland with a dual mission-to minister to Christians already living in Ireland and to begin to convert the Irish. #

Familiar with the Irish language and culture, Patrick chose to incorporate traditional ritual into his lessons of Christianity instead of attempting to eradicate native Irish beliefs. For instance, he used bonfires to celebrate Easter since the Irish were used to honoring their gods with fire. He also superimposed a sun, a powerful Irish symbol, onto the Christian cross to create what is now called a Celtic cross, so that veneration of the symbol would seem more natural to the Irish.

So there is Saint Patrick, a man ahead of his time, attempting to be real and relevant, climbing inside the pagan worldview of another country and culture in order to gain credibility and win converts for Christ.

This is why we celebrate Saint Patrick’s Day.

And this is why I can say with enthusiastic certainty, yes, there is something wonderful about the Irish.

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Mar 17, 2011 12:55 PM Guest Becky  says:
That is fascinating, and great conversation to share today.
Mar 17, 2011 1:22 PM Guest Gary W.  says:
I guess I am one of those "wet blankets" but I have never been fond of St. Patrick's Day.  First of all, I am not Irish nor catholic.  I do not drink any alcoholic beverages, including beer, especially green beer!  I find the whole idea disgusting!  My eldest brother died at 52 years of age of a massive heart attack.  He was an alcoholic.  He claimed he wasn't because he "only" drank beer--sometimes more than a case in one day!  It ruined his family and his two children grew up into two of the most dysfunctional adults who ever stepped foot on the earth.  I am sure that my brother, as a child, never sat out to become an alcoholic, but he did.  I know that some will argue that he did not drink "responsibly."  The fact is, he couldn't!  And it killed him and ruined his family!  Don't EVEN try to get me to join in the "St. Patrick's Day revelry.
Mar 17, 2011 1:13 PM Guest Linda  says:
Wonderful to hear the history! Glad to say I will be telling my family around the dinner table tonight about the real St. Patrick while we eat Corned Beef and Cabbage. There really is something about us irish
Mar 17, 2011 1:24 PM Guest Pam L  says:
Hi   Thank you for the explaination of what St Patricks Day is all about.  One quarter of my family is Irish and they take over the full inpact saying he is Irish.  Thanks for the insight.  Pam
Mar 17, 2011 1:28 PM Guest Ginger  says:
I've also learned that Patrick used the shamrock to teach the Trinity. Each leaf representing God the Father another God the son and another God the Holy Spirit!
Mar 17, 2011 1:44 PM Guest THOMAS K.  says:
I WELCOME YOU MY FELLOW IRISHMAN ON THIS WONDERFUL OCCASION AND LIFE.THROUGH HIS SUPREME GRACE I HAVE COME TOO THE KNOWLEDGE THAT MY GRANDPARENTS CAME TROUGH ELLIS ISLAND FROM THE COUNTY OF CORK.IN 1917.THEN THEY MOVED TO N.E. OHIO AS THERE WAS A INDUSTRIAL REVOLUTION IF EFFECT.WE NEEDED TIRES FOR THE AUTOS THAT HAD STARTED AND FOR THE WAR MACHINE.THUS STARTED MY HERITAGE AS OUR FATHER HAD PLANNED SO MANY YEARS AGO.BUT I AM GLAD TO CELERATE THIS DAY AS IRISHMEN AND THIS LIFE AND FIGHT AS BROTHERS IN CHRIST.GOD BLESS YOU MR.JIM FOR ALL YOU DO.IN HIS  SERVICE,THOMAS K.
Mar 17, 2011 1:30 PM Guest Lisa  says:

Thank you Jim!   My children attend a Lutheran Day School and I wondered why the usual policy of 'free dress' on special days (Super Bowl, Valentine's Day, Christmas) was turned down for St Patrick's Day (yep, they would wear the 'green').  Here we have in a young man an outstanding example of going to the 'Roman's' and teaching Christ's Resurrection and Redemption for those who would believe...  In a pagan society, St Patrick must have endured formidable resistance yet persevered in proclaiming the gospel and bringing souls to Christ.  Of all the days that Christian's could celebrate proudly alongside a secular theme (Valentine's Day), this would be the one to reclaim for its historicity and message of hope and servitude!

While the 'wearing of the green' has political division overtones; in America it traditionally represents 'Ireland' the Emerald Isle...with our great history of Irish immigrants, I think all Americans have a little bit of the Irish in them, blood or not...

Mar 17, 2011 1:47 PM Guest Tracy  says:
Okay, but...though what he did may seem noble from a worldy perspective or religious perspective, wouldn't that be like combining idolatry with the bible. Or say, adding Jesus to a pagan religion as if God would accept a person who's trust isn't completely in Christ alone? I guess I'm confused?
Mar 17, 2011 1:33 PM Guest Cynthia  says:
Thanks for sharing.  We watched the Veggie Tales "Lessons from the Sock Drawer" version of St Patrick's Day with our children.  It really helped us as a family understand what this day really is about.
Mar 17, 2011 1:37 PM Guest JJ Joseph  says:
And don't forget how Patrick promoted literacy and manuscript writing.  More than any other person, Patrick saved civilization in Europe by spreading literacy throughout the lands of the barbarians in Ireland, England, and continental Europe.
Mar 17, 2011 1:40 PM Guest sherri  says:
We are sharing St. Patrick's story at AWANA tonight and will add in your notes that we didn't have. . . Thanks!
Mar 17, 2011 1:52 PM Guest Mary Jane M.  says:
Quite interesting. A little history lesson!!
Mar 17, 2011 1:53 PM Guest Rachel H.  says:
That is a great story. It is also a wonderful story of forgiveness. In a world were it is okay to be mad or mean to someone who was cruel to you, St Patrick shows another side. He really shows God's forgiveness by going back to the country the made him a slave and bring it to God. Rescuing the people from their sin. He is a great Saint that we all can learn a thing or two from. Happy St. Patrick's Day.
Mar 17, 2011 2:03 PM Guest Rachel H.  says in response to Ginger:
Now that you mention it, I heard that too. I should use that sometime when I help teach religious ed. Thanks for the reminder.
Mar 17, 2011 2:00 PM Guest Gwen  says in response to Lisa:

Actually, Valentine's Day is ST. Valentine's Day.  Another great saint in Christianity that we should at least have an idea about so that that day can be better celebrated as well!

Mar 17, 2011 2:09 PM Guest Stacie  says:
This is just more proof that Christianity is the ONE religion that completes culture, rather than destroys it.  It makes me so happy that our God loves being praised in every language and in so many different ways.  He is GOOD!
Mar 17, 2011 2:08 PM Guest Judy  says:
I have long enjoyed celebrating St. Patrick's Day with my children.  It's hard to resist the joy they get from seeing (for one thing) the milk turned green by those "mischievous" leprechauns.  However, this year, as they are older and wiser (and so am I) I decided to add in an age appropriate print out of "Who was St. Patrick anyway" and some fun facts about St. Patrick's Day along with a word search.  They had a wonderful time reading their own special page aloud and we all learned something new. 
Mar 17, 2011 2:12 PM Guest Elaine B  says:
Thanks for the interesting information and a blessed day to you Jim Daly!!  Good to know a real Irishman...You are a special person indeed.  Numbers 6:24-26 A blessing for you..."The LORD bless you and keep you:  The LORD make His face to shine upon you and be gracious to you:  The LORD lift up His countenance upon you, and give you Peace."
Mar 17, 2011 2:13 PM Guest Renee  says in response to Tracy :
Tracy, I admire your caution, though including traditions into how we express our faith is not inherently wrong. Requiring traditions as a part of the faith or worshipping traditions or symbols would be wrong. Conversely, if bonfires were in the culture as a tradition of showing honor, incorporating it wouldn't diminish God's truth. Neither would additional symbolism on a cross, since we don't worship the cross- it's just that, a symbol, & reminder, of our faith in Christ.
Mar 17, 2011 2:14 PM Guest Part Irish (the better part)  says:

(With an Northern Irish accent):

Aye, Jim lad, but can ye dance the jig?!

Éirinn go brách

Happy St. Pat's Day

God Bless

Mar 18, 2011 7:59 AM Guest Tim  says:

I couldn't disagree more.  I don't think this logically could get carried out in a way in American culture that would not leave us shocked.  What exactly would we superimpose from our American culture on the Cross and church practices?  We're talking about pagan idolatry incorporated with Christianity.  Isn't that syncretism?

 

We could change churches into sweat lodges.  We could superimpose crystals, dollar bills, and footballs on the cross, so Americans would find worshipping God more natural.  We'll call it the "American Cross".  We could do a bit of “Tashlan” when it comes to Muslims.  I think we could adulterate Christianity very nicely to make it more palatable to the natives.

 

To be fair, I'll have to consider Apostle Paul's appeal to Mars Hill using "to an unknown god', as a possible defense for this, but so far, I'm not seeing it.

 

"credibility"?  What are we trying to prove to the world?  That their incorrect beliefs actually are Scriptural?  Or that we are like them, so that if we are a little more "American", they'll be a little more "Christian"?

 

I'm becoming more and more concerned about FotF.

Mar 17, 2011 2:22 PM Guest MAMASCALES  says in response to Tracy :

IF YOU'RE CONFUSED, THEN SO AM I.  I WAS THINKING THE EXACT SAME THING AS I READ THE ARTICLE.

AND I ALSO WONDERED IF THAT ISN'T PART OF THE REASON FOR THE RELIGIOUS STRIFE IN IRELAND.

Mar 17, 2011 2:49 PM Guest Ruth  says:
Did you know why the Shamrock is the symbol of the day? It was another handy tool Patrick came up with, and much like the everyday "illustrations" used by Jesus. The three leaves of the shamrock represent the three persons of the Godhead--the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit--all in one leaf. This is another part of Patrick's genius for ministry. He took enough time to observe their culture, very different from his own, and "became one of them," to meet them where they were. He didn't "preach" at them, as if his ways were superior to theirs. This is another way that Patrick resembled his Savior. He was a friend who believed they were worth having a relationship with.
Mar 17, 2011 2:58 PM Guest Art  says in response to Tracy :
You mean like letting Christians continue calling God God, or calling our worship day Sun-day?
Mar 17, 2011 3:03 PM Guest Peter  says in response to Tracy :

Tracy,

your basic question is smart, it's always right to be cautious.

Here's one principle to apply: Paul said "all things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient, all things are lawful for me, but not all things edify."

Did St. Patrick edify? With the virtue of hindsight, it's pretty fair to say that he did.  The Irish christians were a great force for spiritual enlightenment throughout Europe, especially before the tragic schism in 1054 that separated the eastern and western branches of Christianity.

The tribal conflicts between Catholic and Protestant in Ireland aren't due to St. Patrick's use of religious symbolism, but due to a history of conflict between Britain and Ireland.

Mar 18, 2011 8:04 AM Guest Donna  says in response to Tracy :
Tracy, you are one of only a few who ask such questions. Good for you!  It's one thing for Patrick to use a 3-leaf clover to illustrate the Trinity, but it's another thing to use pagan ritual and symbols to "win people to the LORD."  I'm sure Patrick had nothing but the best of intentions, but, according to the Scriptures, YHWH (the LORD) didn't look too kindly on idolatry or even mixing idolatry with His own worship. A case in point is the confrontation between YHWH God's prophet Elijah and the prophets of Ba'al in I Kings 18.  As far as I know, there was not an idol by the name of "Ba'al" like, say, Dagon, the fish god, was an idol.  In Hebrew, the word "ba'al" means "husband", "master", or "lord." The prophets of this "lord" were part of the false religion that wicked King Jeroboam originated in the northern portion of the country after he split Israel in two. He didn't want his part of God's people going down south to worship YHWH God at His Temple in Jerusalem, so he set up golden calves in the north and the south of his kingdom and told the people they could worship YHWH there, totally against the commands of YHWH! (At that time, Jerusalem was the only place where YHWH said He wanted to be worshiped.)  Because of this mixture of pagan practice with YHWH's true religion, Jeroboam and the prophets of Ba'al ("the lord") were considered very wicked in the eyes of the true LORD.   So.... though I sympathize with Patrick ( I am Irish, after all! ), I'm not too sure that YHWH God, the LORD, would've been too pleased with what Patrick did, mixing the pagan (lies) with the truth. BUT... I have to believe that the blood of Yeshua/Jesus "covers a multitude of sins."  God bless you, Tracy, and keep asking those questions!
Mar 17, 2011 5:16 PM Guest Terry  says:

There is one correction needed:   St. Patrick was born in SCOTLAND!!  To say he was from "Britain"  implies he was from England.

("Great Britain" is all of  England,  Scotand,  Ireland and Wales combined.)

 

As someone of Scottish heritage,  I was thrilled to learn that St.  Patrick was actually a Scotsman who evangelized Ireland!

 

Ireland "claims" him,  but so should  Scotland!  :-)

Mar 17, 2011 4:03 PM Guest Tom  says in response to MAMASCALES:
The religous strife you are refering to isn't religous.  When the English invaded the Protestants sided with the English and became wealthy as a result.  So all the strife is economics that happens to be divided among reliious lines.  And, truth be told, it's a little more complicated than that, but that is the basics.
Mar 17, 2011 5:17 PM Guest Laura  says in response to Renee:

I agree, but before we get judgmental, we have to examine our own hearts. John Calvin said "all men are idol factories," and he was right. We have easter bunnies, egg hunts, Christmas trees, and all are traditional symbols of what some consider "real Christianity" but they bear no resemblance to the first century church. Images of Christ? the cross? they are all symbols. I understand Patrick's motivation to express Christianity in terms that the Irish would embrace; even though more enlightened Christians today might not practice that way. Or would we?

 

Remembering pioneers of the Faith for their contribution to it is not necessarily indicating approval of their methods.

Sola Scriptura...Sola Fide....Sola Gratia....Solo Christo...Soli Deo Gloria

Mar 17, 2011 6:04 PM Guest Rainey  says:
I teach Pre-K students and shared these very facts with them today. Another way Patrick incorporated nature into his teaching was to use the shamrock as a way to explain the Trinity...God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. I, too, have Irish roots with siblings named Stuart and Heather!
Mar 17, 2011 6:27 PM Guest Scott  says in response to Tracy :
Hey Tracy,   To use local or cultural symbolism to build a bridge into a people group's lives is a regularly practiced and proven technique. One of the most famous being when missionaries trying to reach tribes in Africa found it impossible to make them understand the idea of God coming to earth, living among us then giving his life on a cross as a sacrifice for our sins. One day they found the entire tribe heading out to a major ceremony with another tribe. They went along and to their horror saw that a baby was about to be sacrificed between the two tribes as a symbol of the peace between the tribes and as an offering for the offenses committed between the two during the past year. They immediately saw their opportunity, rescued the baby, explained the obvious similarities to God's offering of his son...and within days the entirety of both tribes came to believe. The symbol of their faith became a baby superimposed at the food of a cross. St. Patrick worked the symbolism of the Irish's former belief systems into the Christian beliefs so that they could understand better and more naturally make the transition.
Mar 17, 2011 6:48 PM Guest Arlene  says in response to Tracy :
I have the same misgivings.
Mar 17, 2011 7:35 PM Guest Lisa  says:

My family LOVES the movie, "St. Patrick, the Irish Legend", starring Patrick Bergin, Malcolm McDowell, Alan Bates, and Susannah York.  (Amazon.com carries this movie, as does Net Flicks.)  It tells about many of the (true) miracles that God worked through St. Patrick; one of which is similar to Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednigo (the children thrown into the firey furnace in the Old Testament).

 

We've loaned our movie to various friends who have become great fans of St. Patrick too because of this movie.  (It's a great movie!)  (Please note:  We fast forward through the "peasant massacre" when our 6-year-old is watching.)

Mar 23, 2011 6:27 AM Guest James  says:
Been there! Love it! Going back!
Mar 17, 2011 11:07 PM Guest Edith  says in response to Tracy :
Everyone look for their own way to believe, some Christians believe that Lady Gaga and her son "Born this way" is about God. So if you want to believe that St. Patrick was doing the right thing, go for. I know that combine idolatry and God is not right so I choice to not celebred. Remember that any cultural tradition came from pagan religions.
Mar 17, 2011 11:35 PM Guest Tony  says in response to Scott:
Okay Scott - I think I get where you are going with your response to Tracy's very insightful question -  It's a marketing thing, right? So how about we superimpose a pot leaf on the cross to relate to the unchurched Seattle youth? Or maybe a rainbow fish symbol on my car would more effectively reach the LGBT community.  Anybody up for a hybrid Vodoo/Communion ceremony?  We'd be a hit in the Islands! I am exaggerating of course, but I do think Tracy and Laura are making some valid points about where we draw the line. I don't think any of us would argue that using creative symbolism, which people can relate to, is a good tool for sharing the Gospel.  I do feel that some of us question where creativity becomes compromise. For my part, I feel using a shamrock as an illustration of the Holy Trinity is a great idea. Using a baby sacrifice to explain substitutional atonement was an excellent idea as well.  But starting a...let's say... a circumcision ritual to glorify God, eh ...according to my Bible...not so great.  Please don't judge us too harshly if we ask "Is the message influencing the culture, or is the culture influencing the message?"
Mar 18, 2011 3:39 AM Guest susan  says:
And let's not forget that St. Patrick used the Shamrock to teach the concept of the Trinity.  That the Father, Son and Holy Spirit represent each "petal" of the Shamrock, they are different, but the same.
Mar 18, 2011 6:28 AM Guest cheryl  says:
I'm a day late...but I wanted to say that FoF (Odessey) has  a wonderful historical 2 part drama on St. Patrick.  It was was exciting from the first moment to the last (as all their historical stories are) but that was the first time I really came to learn the true story of Patrick.  I always look forward to sharing the Christian part of St. Patrick's story whenever I have opportunity.  I encourage adults to listen to this story...Odessey is not just children's programing !
Mar 23, 2011 6:36 AM Guest alicia  says:
It seems to me that St. Patrick compromised himself in that he was in agreement with the fire burning and adding a sun to the cross. Why would he do that? Is not the Gospel message enough as it stands? Why do Christians believe that they have to compromise themselves and God's word to convert people to Christianity. God said for us to make disicples of all nations.
Mar 23, 2011 6:30 AM Guest Catherine  says:
The Church  today is impotent because it is always grasping at being 'relevant' to a  perverse and godless culture. Forever bowing down to this pagan world  and apologizing for any risk of being offensive it has capitulated the  truth for a phony warm fuzzy.

 

Articles like this aid and abet this situation.  God is Almighty, unapologetic, and DYNAMIC. His mercy is NOT divorced from the force of His Truth.

 

Be ye HOT or COLD or I will SPEW you out of My mouth! God.

Mar 18, 2011 9:24 AM Guest Josh  says:
Ah yes, St Patrick was indeed a man ahead of his time. Usind the worldly things to point non believers to the cross is most effective even in today`s world this can be an effective tool. The church I attend uses this approach also and it is quite effective. Nearly 15,000 attenders gather each weekend over four services and incidently, our church`s slogan is..."Real and Relevant"
Mar 18, 2011 10:04 AM Guest Momma C.  says in response to Gary W.:
Having lived in Ireland for a short time, I love to celebrate St.Patrick's Day with my family. We eat traditional Irish foods and my husband and I may have an Irish (or English) beer. Some people use this holiday as an excuse to party...but those same people will use any day as an excuse to party! I agree that it is a great opportunity to learn something about Irish history and culture! Especially when so many Americans have an Irish heritage!
Mar 23, 2011 9:17 AM Guest Tim B.  says:

We normally call this syncretism, the blending of various religious beliefs into a new religious form. This is why Ireland or Mexico can be almost entirely "Christian" with only a few who trust in Jesus for salvation. But there is something about a wonderful God who would save the Irish who trust His Son's death on the cross as sufficient payment for God to forgive them once and for all (Heb 10:8-12).

Apr 1, 2011 1:54 PM Guest sarah  says in response to Gary W.:
I don't think this article said that to honor St. Patrick people have to drink green beer and become alcoholic's.  I choose not to drink and I am still perfectly capable of celebrating St. Patricks day!
Oct 17, 2011 10:17 AM Guest Terri  says:

I'm not only Irish, but I was a Catholic and am now a Protestant.  More study on St. Patrick is needed.  The history of St. Patrick has been re-written by the Catholics.  He was not only NOT Catholic, but was hunted by the Inquisitioners and it wasn't until he was dead and buried that the Catholic church adopted him and made him a saint.  He did serve as a witness to the Irish to teach them about Jesus and his resurrection and he did promote literacy and wooed the Irish clans to see God and a loving and merciful God.  You can't believe everything you read and the process of re-writing history continues to this day - just as those who have decided the holocaust didn't really happen.   We need to be tolerant of other religions and we need to fight to preserve freedom of religion in this country. We also need to do our homework so that we learn lessons from the past and change the way we do things in the future.

 

 

 

 

*-

Mar 17, 2012 10:28 AM Guest Tara  says in response to Tim:
I am so glad that you spoke up!   I thought perhaps I was the only one thinkin that! There is something wrong about incorporating pagan religion into christianity just to make it easier to worship God.  What about when God was talking to Joshua before they went into the prosmise land and he specifically told them NOT to worship Him as the people in that land worship their gods? As far as I can tell God does not want us to worship Him in similar manners as people worship their false gods.

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